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Request for assistance identifying a rattler
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by Herpetophobe on April 30, 2006
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As you might guess from my nickname, I'm likely the antithesis of most folks who join this forum. I'm frankly afraid of snakes, and I know somewhere between little and nothing about them.
Recently, while hiking in the Red Rock Crossing area of Sedona, Arizona, we ran across (I guess it would be more precise to say "we found ourselves walking in parallel with") what was apparently an immature rattlesnake. I say that because its rattle was pink. The snake itself was about a metre long, thin in proportion to its length. It was green, and had diamond-shaped markings across its back. These extended to bands that appeared to go around its body.
Since it's the closest I've ever been to a rattlesnake in the wild, I became curious to learn a bit more about it. But, not really knowing what I'm looking for, I haven't been able to find anything on the Internet that is helping me identify what type of rattler it was. So I'm wondering if any of the Experts would be able and willing to identify it from either this description or a photo I took which I'd be glad to forward to someone willing to look at it.
For what it may be worth, my fear is not without respect. I did nothing more intrusive than take its photo from about three metres away. Thanks in advance to anyone who might care to assist.
Steve
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RE: Request for assistance identifying a rattler
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by Herpetophobe on April 30, 2006
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Chalk it up to fear, but I missed the fact that our "pal" does have a black tail. Everything else seems to fit as well. I think you've got it, Matt. Thanks very much for your help.
Steve
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RE: Request for assistance identifying a rattler
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by Cro on May 1, 2006
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Steve The snake does sound like a black-tailed rattlesnake.
You might want to upload the photo you took of the rattlesnake to our Photo Album ``Snakes for Identification`` section, and let us know here when you have done that.
It is good to hear that you took some time to observe the snake. They really are amazing animals. Taking the time to learn more about venomous snakes is a great way to get over fear of them.
Best Regards JohnZ
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RE: Request for assistance identifying a rattler
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by SwampY on May 1, 2006
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This might help...
http://www.venomousreptiles.org/chadm/
just click the appropo links and you'll get an ID
Chad Minter
Author
Venomous Snakes of the Southeast
http://www.envenomated.com
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RE: Request for assistance identifying a rattler
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by Cro on May 1, 2006
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I really hate to complain about the snake identification site posted by Chad.
However, I find that it would be of very little use to anyone not already familiar with snakes, or anyone working with a live specimen they saw in the field, or even took a photo of.
It would be of some use to a college student in an anatomy class who has to identify a pickled snake in a jar, and perhaps to someone who brings home a dead rattlesnake and is willing to learn some scientific terms and do some research.
Steve made some great detailed observations of the rattlesnake he saw in Arizona, much more than usual. From his description of the snake and the locality, it is fairly easy to come up with Crotalus molossus.
The identification site listed would still have had little use for him.
For example, it asks the following questions:
Is a pit-like hole present between the nostril and eye? (Most people will not get close enough to a live rattlesnake to see this)
Is the dorsal head surface covered with small scales or less than nine enlarged plates? (Most people will not get close enough to a live rattlesnake to see this also)
Are the supra-ocular scales raised or hornlike? (Most people will not know what a supra-ocular scale is)
If the tail is unicolored black or dark brown or dark gray with very faint bands..click here (Most people will probably know what color the tail was)
Do white scales occur within the dark dorsal blotches; usually six or fewer scales in the internasal-prefrontal region? (Most people are not going to get close enough to a rattlesnake to count the scales in the internasar-prefrontal region, even if they know what it is)
While the site did correctly lead me to Crotalus molossus, the average non-snake person will not know a supra-ocular scale from an internasal-prefrontal region.
It is more of a resource for someone working with a pickled snake or dead snake, and some scientific experience.
For the average person trying to identify a snake, they would do much better looking through the photos and range maps in a good field guide.
Best Regards JohnZ
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RE: Request for assistance identifying a rattler
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by Herpetophobe on May 1, 2006
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Aha! Had I found that "snakes for identification" section on my own, I'd have posted the photo there originally. It's uploaded now, awaiting clearance from Whoever Checks These Pictures Out Before They're Released Publicly (a fine idea, I might add).
While we're waiting, I'd like to thank all of you who have responded for suppressing any "oh, lord, not another ignorant gate-crasher" reactions you may have had, and posting such informative and friendly replies. Note to Chad: I did try your link, but I couldn't get past the "pit-like hole" question, even by enlarging the photo. I did appreciate your suggestion, though.
I'm hopeful the photo will enable you folks to provide the "definitive" identification. Since we do hike often in the Sonoran Desert (even in summer!) the more knowledge I can acquire the better off I will be.
Steve
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RE: Request for assistance identifying a rattler
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by Cro on May 2, 2006
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Steve: The photo has been posted, and it is a black-tailed rattlesnake.
There is a excellent website you might want to visit that has information on the snakes of Arizona. If you click on the small pattern samples, it will take you to photos of each species and range maps.
Check it out at
http://www.reptilesofaz.com/herp-snakes.html
Best Regards JohnZ
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RE: Request for assistance identifying a rattler
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by Herpetophobe on May 2, 2006
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I did check that site. It (and this site) are now in my bookmarks. Thanks again, all!
Steve
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