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RE: FREEHANDLEING NUT
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by jparker1167 on December 12, 2008
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how are they venomoids ? he has a video of the puff adder biting a rat and it dieing, what reason do you have to think they are venomiods i would like to see how you found out.
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RE: FREEHANDLEING NUT
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by Crotalusssp on December 12, 2008
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Even if they are voids, the handling in such a manor is certainly not to be encouraged or condoned.
Charles
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RE: FREEHANDLEING NUT
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by tnblader on December 12, 2008
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The videos where he is feeding them the rats aren’t in the video the entire time and seem to instantly die and a person told me they were voids purchased from him. Even a void will strike a mouse and how hard is to move the camera and thump its head on something o look the venom did its job. Even the constrictors I have if the prey gets free they move around all slow and stuff cause they are in pain/shock.
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RE: FREEHANDLEING NUT
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by BillS on December 12, 2008
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Guys I know im new to this site and stuff but this guy on the video is RETARTED!! I know Alot about herping stuff and this guy is retarted bad.
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RE: FREEHANDLEING NUT
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by geckolover on December 12, 2008
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Even if they are voids, they could still possibly inject with left over venom from ducts. Also remember the snake may have bit the rat in the heart, which would have been a fast kill. Even if it is a void done correctly, it could kill the hobby by other people trying it, and I would like to keep hots legally when I grow up.
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RE: FREEHANDLEING NUT
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by JoeCrotalid on December 12, 2008
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In the medical profession we have a saying, "You can't fix stupid! and stupidy equals job security!" It is an absolute shame that people out there post these videos that demonstrate the wrong way to do things. Voids or venomous-many youngsters have access to these videos on the net, and what's to stop them from picking up a hot and saying, "Well I saw this guy on Youtube do it and he didn't get bit!" Next thing you know their in the ED and I'm getting called for a bite that was totally avoidable.
To the responsible keepers I give Kudos because I see the bite numbers in the private sector, and to people like this individual-I would like to advise you to remove your video if possible and get with a respected keeper to learn the proper way of handling before you end up in my ED with a bite or worse yet, some unknowledable kid who sees your video.
Joe P. RN, SPI
Snakebite Specialist
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RE: FREEHANDLEING NUT
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by theemojohnm on December 12, 2008
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geckolover, please do not take this as me "starting trouble" or anything of that nature. I only notice that you have ambitions to keep hots some day, notice that you are young, and from your posts here so far, notice that you seem to have the right ambitions and passion to conduct yourself safely.
Although I must ask, what IS a "venomoid done correctly"? There are no "standards" today among folks who slice up snakes in their basements and claim to be "qualified vets". I am curious to know how anyone can be qualififed in a proceedure that has no common verterinary standards and is not widely accpeted.
I have no further comments on this video, except, of course, an echo of everyone elses feelings. I try not to even waste my time anymore. If, we DO get enough folks to take a whole minute and 10 seconds to sign up for a youtube account, and all complain ("flag" this video for harmful content) about this video, we CAN get it removed. Just a thought. I have already done such regarding this video, and several others posted here lately.
Take Care,
~John Mendrola.
(Pennsylvania Woodland Herpetological).
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RE: FREEHANDLEING NUT
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by geckolover on December 13, 2008
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Theemojohnm, I didn't take it as an attack. I can understand that because I am young, people wont take me seriously. I have heard of vets who remove the ducts, and I didn't mean those vets could make a hot safe, I just meant there less of a chance of envenomation if the ducts were removed, which I learned can grow back. I didn't mean to say done correctly and was in a rush. I meant more safely.
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RE: FREEHANDLEING NUT
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by Cro on December 13, 2008
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Even when done by a "qualified" vet, we are talking about a very delicate operation that can easily be botched, and not done completely right.
Think about what reason a vet, or a basement hack, has in creating a veonomod snake. It comes down to one word, Money. The person doing the surgery is not interested in the health of the snake, or your health, to them, it is just about making money.
Think about this. Are you willing to trust your life handling a supposedly safe venomous snake, that was operated on by someone that you do not know, half way across the country, whose only interest is doing as many venomectomies in a day as he can, to make maximum money ? If you are, you are putting very, very little Value on Your Life !
If you buy a venomoid forest cobra for say $300.00, and trust your life on that cobra being safe, you have just put a value on your life of $300.00 !
Best Regards
John Z
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RE: FREEHANDLEING NUT
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by Buzztail1 on December 13, 2008
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Because I do see both sides...
If you buy that same Forest Cobra (venomoided) and keep it as you would a complete (non-venomoided) animal and do not get bitten and keep it successfully for the natural lifespan of the animal - then I would say that you successfully bought an unused insurance policy and, in my opinion, this is the only possibly good scenario for keeping a venomoid animal.
You would have done just as well to buy an uncut animal.
For what it is worth, I do believe that there are veterinarians that stand by their work and do not agree with all of our reasosn for disliking venomoids. Just as with any profession, there are people who take pride in their work and there are those who just punch the clock for the money.
BUT
The other possibilitites are just all bad...
1. You keep it for a "short" time and figure you have learned all there is to keeping a "hot" one and move on (not necessarily a valid assumption).
2. You get bitten by it - it is truly venomoid and you survive - POSSIBLY you learn that you are not careful enough to keep the "real thing" (I guess this could be a positive outcome but getting bitten is still bad).
3. You get bitten by it - it has regenerated or was not properly venomoided to begin with - and now you have a full-blown bite on your hands - WAY NOT GOOD!
4. You keep it and play with it and teach others (through YouTube etc) the wrong ideas about handling snakes thereby leading them to try the same thing with a possibly/probably unsafe animal which will then bite them and so on...
Irresponsible people will keep venomoids or venomous or anything else they want. Whatever they keep will not change whether they are irresponsible or not. In other words, it is not the snake (venomous or venomoid) that makes them irrespsonsible - that is just what brings them to our notice. These people should not be keeping anything but are protected under the same umbrella that allows us to keep what we keep. No matter what the hobby/profession, there are irresponsible yahoos making everyone else look bad. It is NOT the venomoids that make us look bad. It is the people.
Just my own opinions.
R/
Karl
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