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Speak Out: Where do you stand on “free handling” of venomous snakes.

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jared on 2003-04-11
Always sharp Karl, well put.

Jared

Buzztail1 on 2003-04-10
Hmmm...another controversial issue to take a stance on!
Back in the 70s when I brought home my first Canebrake Rattlesnake and my first Southern Copperhead from the same trip there was no-one around to teach me the safer ways to handle snakes. So, I pinned them down and picked them up behind the head and put them into my cages. Since then, the world has turned. Someone invented the internet, books have been published and I have learned volumes. Now I use hooks almost exclusively. I have tongs for the rare occasion when I need them. I believe in doing things the safest way possible. I do not believe in freehandling something that can kill me or do me grave bodily harm. I do not get paid enough money to throw it away on a monumentally huge hospital bill because I made a mistake and misread the intentions of an animal whose brain is the size of a thimble. After 27 years of experience with venomous snakes from all over the world, I hardly consider myself "some Johnny Hobbyist" and with all of my public education work I don't consider my opinion to be either "armature" or armchair or amateur. I also don't believe in the addage of two types of venomous keepers - those who have been bitten and those who will be. I believe in being as safe and careful as possible. Freehandling does not fall into either of those two categories - so I don't believe in doing that.
There are lots of ways to die or lose a limb or body part. Writhing in pain, watching venom work it's way through my body, praying that I get that one Doctor that does in fact know what he's doing is not my idea of the best way to go. Especially if the reason I got bit is because I thought I was too good to use available safety equipment.
Does that make me chicken? Less of a man in someone's eyes?
Well, years from now, I will still be able to put my thumb to my nose and waggle ALL of my fingers at you. And those people who actually need to know how much of a man I am are pretty much satisfied.
Freehandling? Unneccessary risk in almost every case we see today!
As for Bill Haast, Ray Hunter, Albert Killian and any other professionals that get listed, I am pretty sure that they can each tell you exactly what mistake they made for each bite they took. Anyone can make a mistake. Given that listing, I, too, can say that in combination with a few others I am part of over 100 years experience and am part of handling over a million snakes. Anyone can say that and thus everyone's opinion is valid because it defines how they feel and believe.
Good luck to all,
I wish you all a safe outcome regardless of your personal handling techniques.
Karl H. Betz

CFoley on 2003-04-10
I dont freehandle any front-fanged venomous. I personally find it stupid. The only place popularity stands under the pros, is that when they do get bit, there is not much publicity, because many people know of his whereabouts, if that is, he cant handle the treatment himself. I also dont believe in the saying "There are two types of venomous keepers, those who have been bit, and those who will be bitten." There are many tools, equip, etc that can be used to avoid ANY physical contact. Trap boxes are the number one tool in my eyes. I own tongs, but dont care for actually tonging them...i use them as a hook, and only squeeze if an animal double backs on me.

Above is just my opinion, if you are comfortable with freehandling, than go for it I guess, I just can not side with you because I am not comfortable with it.

Chris

jay72 on 2003-04-10
I would define "professionals' as somebody like Bill Haast or Ray Hunter who make/made there living through venom extraction, etc, or somebody like Albert Killian who has been performing snake shows for the public for over 30 years. These individuals are in this more than just as a hobby.

jared on 2003-04-10
Just a reply to anonymous.
It does not necessarily damage the animal or hinder its health to work with it. You should know that, certain species will actually be accoustmed to being handled, again cobras and large crots off the top of my mind. They can become so placid that they act like corn snakes (not to say they should be treated as such) but it is possible. As far as your comment on REAL Drs, quite frankley, most of the "professionals" in herpetology, dont have doctorates, and I have heard a couple of known Dr.s say things about herps which are definately false. Not to drop names (but it seems popular) but Haast, Ripa, and many others dont have phds and are much more highly regarded (in the field of herpetology) than many people who have doctorates. Hey Bush graduated from Yale and his IQ is an 86. Bites do lead to laws, thats why I dont do it, but then again I know alot of supposed amateurs that know alot more about reptilian behavior than most Dr.s, alot is to be said for hands on experience in this field, its not physics or chemistry, it is a branch of zoology, and animal experience matters.

Jared

Anonymous on 2003-04-10
Whats your idea of professionals?
People who have been bitten and near death multiple times; Or people who use the snakes to make money? How would you define professionalism if there isn't a degree in this particular area?

Anonymous on 2003-04-10
The only time you should touch any venomous snake with your hands is to extract venom or to treat it for a medical problem. Tailing animals for some species can be used but is often over used. The placing of hands on an animal leads to an increase on stress hormones being released. For the animals health it is better to limit contact with it. These are not toys. As far as injecting with venom. This has been disproven by many real doctors. Dr. Minton being one. If you want to continue to be able to keep these animals you need to think before acting.
All actions have a reaction. Bites lead to laws.

jay72 on 2003-04-09
I agree. i feel that there are people out there like Bill Haast, Ray Hunter and Albert Killian who have been working with these snakes for 30+ years and have a deep understanding of their behavior, i feel it should only be done by professionals like those mentioned above and not by somebody just trying to show off. I spoke with Albert about this after a snake show where he free handed a 14' Malasian King, he said that is the best way for him to keep control of the snake. I have also seen him on the Discovery Channel free handling a large Gaboon.

NickVenom911 on 2003-04-09
I have been free handling large body pit vipers, especially Gaboon vipers for a while now. Call me an idiot but I am very experienced in this technique and im not some Johnny Hobbyist on a suicide adrenaline mission. Technique and understanding of the snake is essential and it is something that must be passed down from experience. I’ve never even had a close call when using this technique, not to mention it caries a legitimate reason. Heavy body vipers like Gaboon are very sensitive to pressure in the rib area. Poor hooking can break ribs and even cause a drop from lack of control. Gaboon vipers that I’ve free handled have lived up to 15 years in captivity!! Coincidence? I think not.All im saying is don’t be so quick to call people idiots. I’ve worked with some of the best snake handlers in the world all of which have their own different seemingly high risk techniques, that are simply routine to them. Professionals like Bill Haast, Ray Hunter, Albert Killian and a few others have an understanding of the snakes personalities that most hobbyist could not even fathom. Not to mention they are all still alive after a combined 100 plus years of experience with probably over 1 million snakes. Until you can say the same keep your armature comments to your self.

timberrattlesnake89 on 2003-04-08
i have and prefer to freehead than used tongs or hold by the back of the neck because holding with tongs or pinning give the snake alot of stress and if by accidently let go it will strike very hard and probaly invenomate much more venom than needed so i do not like to pin or tong i normaly just use a hook but if out in wild collecting them i use a strudy stick and try to griab tail without it striking

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